Comments on: ARE JEHOVAH’S WITNESSES A CULT? https://rotay.com/2012/03/are-jehovahs-witnesses-a-cult/ WHAT WILL HAPPEN TO AMERICA? Wed, 04 Apr 2012 12:32:58 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=6.9.4 By: gregW:-) https://rotay.com/2012/03/are-jehovahs-witnesses-a-cult/#comment-2239 Wed, 04 Apr 2012 12:32:58 +0000 http://rotay.com/?p=3400#comment-2239 Hi there Rob @ rotay.com

I am writing in regard to your blog – ARE JEHOVAH’S WITNESSES A CULT?
While you did state many things correctly you also have a number of errors in your understanding about Jehovah’s Witnesses.

One thing that should be understood about Jehovah’s Witnesses right from the start is that we hold the Bible as the ultimate authority on all matters regarding a Christians life , and his beliefs.
When a belief is in conflict with the Bible , we go with the Bible as the standard for the truth.
We view that the Bible is truly Gods word to mankind , and that it is not something that can be trumped by man made religious teaching or doctrine.
As the Bible is the basis for what we believe and not by doctrine created by church leaders based on their own reasoning , Jehovah’s Witnesses are not held into the pattern of belief that other churches stick to.

2 Timothy 3:16, 17 ”All Scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining in righteousness, 17 that the man of God may be fully competent, completely equipped for every good work.”

I have looked over your text and found some ‘issues’ that need clearing up.
I hope that you will take the time to read my response.

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”During the late 90s, there were less than 100,000 Jehovah’s Witnesses. Now there are about seven million around the world. ”

This is not true.
In 1990 there already was over 4 million active ministers worldwide.
This figure does not include a vast number of others (visitors, interested people) that regularly attend the Kingdom halls to listen to the presentations.
It also does not take into account children.

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”When 1914 had come and gone, Russell modified his teachings and claimed Jesus had, in fact, returned to Earth, but that his return was invisible.”

Also this is not true.
Jesus has not returned to the Earth in any fashion , he is in fact unable to return as a human.
For Jesus to take back a physical body it would make invalid the ransom sacrifice that his death made.
So any return must be in an an invisible sense , one where Jesus keeps his spirit body.
The Bible tells us that Jesus is set up as the king of Gods kingdom and from that position of power he is able to direct matters for the greatest benefit.
From there he is able to exercise power over the Kingdom preaching work here on Earth , but up until this time he has personally remained in the heavens.

———

1. God is not a Trinity; the doctrine is inspired by the Devil.

This is quite true.
The Bible does not mention anything of a triune godhead that can make up the trinity.
When we investigate religious customs we find the trinity was an ancient belief from Mesopotamia and their pagan religions.
Of the denominations that believe in the trinity none are able to explain it from the Bible.
They instead fall back to the views and opinions of their priestly class , and when pressed for an answer they call it , a ‘mystery’.
However calling something a mystery is no excuse for teaching a lie.

The trinity is in fact completely diametrically opposite to what is taught in the Bible.
One of the core beliefs of Christianity is that Jesus died and thus payed the ransom to release mankind from death.

Now for the trinity concept to be true ALL 3 persons of the trinity MUST be alive at all times.
You cannot have a two person trinity……
So , if we believe that the trinity is indeed true , then we MUST conclude that Jesus did NOT in fact die at the end of his earthly life and the the threefold trinity remained intact.

If that is the case then the ransom sacrifice was NOT made , and –
1. mankind has no hope for the future,
2. the rest of the Bible was written for nothing,
3. all those that have lived and died for Bible truth just wasted their time,
4. our belief in God has no worth as nothing will come from it.

If we believe in the trinity then our future prospects are the same as the animal in the field.
The trinity is incompatible with Christianity and is not supported in Bible text.

———

2. Jesus is not to be worshipped or prayed to-he is only an angel

Absolutely true.
Even when Jesus was on Earth he directed his apostles to ONLY pray to his father that was in the heavens – to Jehovah.

Matthew 4:10 ”Then Jesus said to him: “Go away, Satan! For it is written, ‘It is Jehovah your God you must worship, and it is to him alone you must render sacred service.’”
Matthew 6:9 “YOU must pray, then, this way: “‘Our Father in the heavens, let your name be sanctified. ”

This is what he did , and this is what Christians likewise will also do.

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3. Jesus Christ is a “created being” who at one time did not exist.

Also true.
The Bible calls Jesus Gods first born son , his first creation.
Colossians 1:15 ”He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. . .”

The reason why church doctrines go against Bible fact is in order to support their trinity doctrine.
If there was a time when Jesus didn’t exist , then the trinity is immediately proved false , and the church leaders will not hear of that as it would unravel a whole web of lies.
So they deny the Bible text.
The Bible clearly says that there was a time when Jehovah God existed and Jesus did not.
The trinity is false.

———

4. The Holy Spirit is not a person but is “God’s active force” (i.e., gravity, electricity, etc.)

True.
One of the fundamental rules of the trinity concept is that all parts , or persons of the trinity are equal.
That means that they are coequal and co-eternal. (their words not mine)
However the Bible NEVER talks about the holy spirit as a person.
While Jesus and Jehovah are spoken of as having feeling , desire and a consciousness , the holy spirit never is.
The Bible quotes Jesus and Jehovah as speaking , but never the holy spirit.
The Bible talks about Jesus and Jehovah residing in the heavens , the holy spirit is not spoken of as residing ‘anywhere’…..
That certainly doesn’t sound like equality to me.

1 Corinthians 11:3 ”But I want YOU to know that the head of every man is the Christ; in turn the head of a woman is the man; in turn the head of the Christ is God.”
Not only does this verse show that Jesus is lower than Jehovah , which is another problem for trinitarians , there is no mention at all of the holy spirit being a person involved —- again.

If a person to chooses to believe in the trinity doctrine then they must accept the holy spirit is a real person.
However there is not even one verse in the Bible that backs that belief up and in fact the trinity was not considered to be a Christian teaching until the 3rd century.
Neither Jesus or the first century Christians followed it or taught it , and neither will true Christians today.

———

5. Heaven is hope only for select Jehovah’s Witnesses. The majority of Jehovah’s Witnesses hope to live on “paradise earth.”

Not …. entirely true.
At the last supper Jesus explained that the apostles that were with him had the opportunity to join a class of people that would reign as ‘kings and preists’ over mankind.
As man’s representatives they would assist Jesus in the process of return mankind back to perfection.
This limited opportunity was open to all those that died after Jesus died.
Most of the number of those that would later work in the heavens were made up BEFORE Jehovah’s Witnesses were formed.

As this number for life in heaven was limited the rest have the opportunity to live on paradise Earth.
This Earthly life was in fact what man was created for……..

Just as Adam and Eve were intended to live forever on Earth , that is the same unchanged purpose for loyal mankind.
Jehovah has not changed , and neither has his purpose for man.

Isaiah 55:11 ”–my word that goes forth from my mouth will prove to be. It will not return to me without results, but it will certainly do that in which I have delighted, and it will have certain success in that for which I have sent it.”

———

6. Heaven is limited only to 144,000 Jehovah’s Witnesses.

Not true.
As noted above the vast majority of those that we to be used in heaven were made up prior to the formation of the Jehovah’s Witnesses.

———

7. Jehovah’s Witnesses are the only “true Christians.” All churches and denominations are considered “false religion.”

Collectively this is true , individually it may not be.
I will explain.

The ONLY people that are true Christians , are those that follow Jesus direction and follow in his footsteps as layed out for us in the Bible.
Of course we will not know what is in the Bible if we do not learn about it , and if we don’t put what we learn into action then any learning is a waste of time.
Jesus well knew that many people would claim to be Christians but would by their own actions or inactions would prove otherwise.
Jesus considered this false Christian people as strangers to him that he did not know , strangers that were like criminals.
For these false Christians there is no ‘happy ending’.

Matthew 7:21-23  “Not everyone saying to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the kingdom of the heavens, but the one doing the will of my Father who is in the heavens will.  Many will say to me in that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and expel demons in your name, and perform many powerful works in your name?’  And yet then I will confess to them: I never knew YOU! Get away from me, YOU workers of lawlessness.”

Only those that do God will as directed by Jesus are TRUE Christians.
Buy their actions and Bible based beliefs Jehovah’s Witnesses prove that they qualify being called TRUE Christians.

Of course this boils down to an individual matter too.
If a PERSON isn’t doing Gods will and living life as they ought to , even if they claim to be a Jehovah’s Witness , it is all for nothing.

———

8. There is no Hell or eternal judgment (“Hell” is simply the grave.)

Not quite true.
The words in the Bible that in English are translated as ‘Hell’ are Hades and Sheol.
Hades and Sheol are the common grave that man gets put into when he ceases to live.
So the word Hell is quite appropriate to use as the place where dead bodies are put , however the problem arises when the doctrine of ‘hellfire’ is involved.

Hellfire is a teaching NOT found in the Bible , but one which can easily be traced back to non Christian religions.
The hellfire teaching dictates that it is a place for the eternal souls of dead people go to be tortured at the hands of demon creatures for their past sins.
The simple definition is its the place that sinner go to be tortured when they die.
The Bible very clearly says that there is no consciousness when a person dies and that their is NO invisible spirit inside us that floats away to some other reality.
Our body simply decays into the ground and we are no more.

Psalm 146:4 ”—he goes back to his ground; In that day his thoughts do perish.”

While hellfire is supposedly the destiny for the wicked , people that believe in hellfire have a problem when the Bible tells us that Jesus did in fact go to hell when he died.
As Jesus died a perfect sinless man , then sending him into hellfire for torture is not logical.

It however is logical to conclude , along with all the other Bible facts , , that there is no hellfire , and that hell is just the grave where corpses are put.

Where a common confusion occurs is when poor Bible translations deliberately mis-translate Gehenna for Hell in order to support their false hellfire doctrines.

———

9. There is no life after death except for the 144,000 Jehovah’s Witnesses.

We are back on this again. 🙂
The Bible once again tells us that the dead remain in the grave until the resurrection occurs.
This is at a future date after the coming war of Armageddon.
However those that were chosen since Jesus time to work in the heavens that already have received a resurrection to heavenly life.
As I said previously , this number was mostly filled a long time before the Jehovah’s Witnesses were formed.

———

10. Jesus second coming happened invisibly and secretly in 1914.

Correct.
While many thought that Jesus would return in a physical sense at some time this view was based on incorrect reasoning.
The Bible nowhere says that Jesus would come literally to the Earth at any time in a physical way , but it does talk about Jesus activity in this period of time as an invisible spirit being.

Jehovah’s Witnesses of the day did not know what exactly would happen in 1914 but they knew by prophecy that something significant would happen at that time.
While many world analysts though the world in a positive light in the early 1900s the Witnesses were preaching that something was just around the corner…and it was.
In a very short time and with little warning WW1 broke out .
This is considered to be the same time when Jesus ‘came’ into power in the heavens and his first action was to restrict Satan and his demons access to the heavens.
Having a great deal of anger they took it out on mankind with WW1 , and have been doing so with endless wars ever since.

Revelation 12:9 ”–down the great dragon was hurled, the original serpent, the one called Devil and Satan, who is misleading the entire inhabited earth; he was hurled down to the earth, and his angels were hurled down with him.”

Revelation 12:12 ”On this account be glad, YOU heavens and YOU who reside in them! Woe for the earth and for the sea, because the Devil has come down to YOU, having great anger, knowing he has a short period of time.”

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11. The “first resurrection” occurred in 1918.

While the date cannot be directly proven in the Bible it is logical to conclude that this is true.
As Jesus came to power in 1914 as the head of the Messianic Kingdom he would require his heavenly co-workers to be present there after that time , and not before.
In other Bible prophecy which seems to be related a delay of a few years was in order before the first resurrection started.

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12. Jesus did not rise from the dead bodily but as a spirit being.

Correct.
As I stated before if Jesus was to be resurrected in a REAL physical body as he had before this would invalidate the ransom sacrifice that he had offered.
In a legal sense it is NOT possible for Jesus to take back his ransom payment , and have it remain payed.
Therefore , in the instances after his death that Jesus was seen by his friends this was not a real physical body , nor his old body , but rather was a very powerful and convincing but temporary physical manifestation.

1 Peter 3:18 ”Christ died once for all time concerning sins, — he being put to death in the flesh, but being made alive in the spirit—”

Jesus human body died and he was resurrected as a spirit being.

He did not ascend to heaven with a physical body.
That teaching is not supported by the scriptures.

———

13. Jesus was equal to Adam (just a man).

That’s rite.
Adam was a perfect man , he had a perfect body and sound reasoning faculties , and while he was able to live forever if he remained faithful he was not by any means a super being.
Adam simply was a perfect human.
Now for the ransom sacrifice of Jesus to be valid it had to be an equal payment for what was lost back in Eden.

If Jesus had of been lesser than Adam , then the ransom payment would not have been corresponding in value.
Likewise , if Jesus had of been a super human or had supernatural powers then that too would make the ransom sacrifice unbalanced.

The ransom amount was specific , and it was that EXACT value that had to be payed , not less , not more.

1 Timothy 2:5, 6 ”–a man, Christ Jesus, who gave himself a corresponding ransom for all—”

Jesus must only be a perfect human just like Adam was.

———

14. Jesus could have sinned and failed in his mission.

Exactly right.
Just as Adam failed so technically could Jesus.
The fact that Satan tried on occasions to tempt Jesus , proves that it was indeed possible for him to fail.
Matthew 4:1 ”Then Jesus was led by the spirit up into the wilderness to be tempted by the Devil. ”

However Jehovah God knew the character of Jesus and had full confidence that he was able to , and willing to complete his assigned task.

———

15. Jesus was not born the savior but became the savior at his baptism.

The word ‘savior’ is defined as a person that saves another from a problem or calamity.
The Bible refers to Jesus being the promised savior at his birth.
Luke 2:11 ”–because there was born to YOU today a Savior, who is Christ [the] Lord,–”

However while it was true that he was the promised savior that the Jewish people were anticipating he didn’t qualify for this job until he had dedicated his life to do Gods will.
At his baptism he was qualified to offer himself as a sacrifice and took on the job as the savior , but he wasn’t TRULY the savior of mankind until the value of his sacrifice was accepted , and that was after his resurrection to heaven.
Acts 5:31 ”–God exalted this one as Chief Agent and Savior to his right hand –”

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16. God is not omnipresent.
17. God is not omniscient.

I have grouped these together.
These words are not found in the Bible.
The Bible clearly tells us that Jehovah God lives in the heavens , and that is his realm.
While he is able to observe matters on Earth he does not live here.
Therefore in the strictest sense of the word , God is not omnipresent.

The Bible tells us that God has the ability to foresee how things will work out in the end.
Being powerful enough to make anything that he desires come true shouldn’t be confused with omniscience.
While he knows the big picture he does not know all the fine details , he doesn’t need to know.

For us that means that we have the freedom and ability to steer our lives in either a good way or a bad way without a predetermined outcome already set in place.

———

18. Jehovah’s Witnesses are not sure of their salvation.

Regarding salvation the apostle Paul gave the illustration of a runner in a race.

1 Corinthians 9:24 ”Do YOU not know that the runners in a race all run, but only one receives the prize? Run in such a way that YOU may attain it. ”

The runner that would achieve the prize would be the one that doesn’t tire out , and that reaches the end.
At any time the runner can stop if he chooses to and give up , but he wont win the prize if he does so.
He doesn’t get the prize for just ‘having a go’ , no he only can get the prize if he continues to the end.

Likewise it is ONLY Christians that follow Jesus example and do God’s will to the END , will be those that COULD receive the free gift of everlasting life.
This prize cannot be earned , it can only be awarded , and only to those that complete the race.

Matthew 10:22 ”–he that has endured to the end is the one that will be saved.”

———

19. All earthly governments are controlled by the Devil.

The Bible tells us that the whole world is under the power of Satan.
Mankind’s history of self rule has clearly shown that he does so not out of good reasons , but out of those related to power , money and greed.
Most governments at one time or another have displayed by their actions that they are not guided by true goodness , indeed , most have supported wars and various atrocities over the centuries , particularly so during our 20th and 21 centuries.
Many too have actively suppressed Christianity , and those that follow it.

For those Satan clearly is their puppet master.

1 John 5:19 ”–the whole world is lying in the [power of the] wicked one. ”

———

20. The Holy Spirit is only available to select Jehovah’s Witnesses.

Not true.
Holy spirit , which the Bible tells us is Gods active force to cause a change or action , was available to all those in the past that served him correctly.
No doubt Noah and his family had Gods help to achieve his big building task when the ark was made.
Likewise Moses and Abraham also had Gods help , and of course not forgetting the numerous prophets of ancient Israel.
Mary and Joseph no doubt had the holy spirit on them to help protect Jesus through his unborn and child years.

Luke 1:35 ”In answer the angel said to her: “Holy spirit will come upon you, and power of the Most High will overshadow you. For that reason also what is born will be called holy, God’s Son ”

Only those that do Gods will according to the Bible can get his holy spirit.

———

”In my view, Jehovah’s Witnesses meet the criteria and definition of a “cult” because their beliefs are bizarre and do not represent true Christian doctrine, but that’s just my take.”

You are most welcome to have your own opinion , and I most certainly am encouraging of self thought on such matters.
However, when you evaluate what the Bible REALLY teaches and discount the man made traditions and doctrines of men , then what the Jehovah’s Witness do believe and teach , is correct.

A ‘cult’ in the modern sense is often a group lead by a charismatic individual with the goal of control , power or for financial gain over those that follow him.
With this view in mind Jehovah’s Witnesses clearly are not a cult.
We do not follow anyone else except for Jesus (just as the Bible instructs us to do) , no man has power or control over us , we are not coerced out of our money , there is no ‘hat’ passed around , there is no charge for the services rendered by those taking the lead , and we do not pay tithes.
If at any time a person no longer wishes to be a Jehovah’s Witness they are completely free to leave , the choice is theirs alone.

To me , that doesn’t sound like cult to me , that sounds just like the way the Bible tells Christians ought to be.

Regards

gregW:-)

PS — To save space and time I have omitted quoting extensively from the scriptures , but I and any Jehovah’s Witness are more than happy to prove these points to you from the Bible.

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